Debt is just an illusion

Debt isn't really real since banks don't actually lend out real money. They only use a tiny fraction of actual cash, while most of it is just made-up debt. For every dollar banks have, they can loan out nine. So, if the US debt is around 38 trillion, then only about 10 to 15 percent of that is real cash.

So what's your point here? because what you said is obvious and everybody knows about it. The actual monetary system is a continious system of non-stopping debts. The story had started longtime ago when human thought to migrate from coins to paper money. Without this development, central banks hadn't to be existed at first place with the simple role is to manage the operation of general debt. Paper money is the perfect way for governors to scam their citizens.

This is the reason why we have Bitcoin as a financial freedom. A system that is transparent and can not be manipulated by any government or individual because everything is outrightly transparent on the blockchain. This is why the government would never want to run their system through blockchain as many of them could be caught because we know that out of 99% percent of money they are borrowing only 20% are being used for the said purpose of borrowing that particular money, especially country like Nigeria they aren't always transparent with the money they are borrowing.

This is fractional reserve, unfortunately the new money created by that leveraged system does equate to the original money used.  Its the expansionary nature of the fractional system and does play a large part in the economic swings we see between boom and bust.   Its not possible to just cancel all the new debt and new money, that would be greatly deflationary and probably leads to the problems seen in the 1930's.    That might be the best thing if a proper system replaced this current regime with sound money, its very unlikely to occur.  I would only expect some intervention that once again benefits the banks and damages the standing of the common population.  Either way it would be chaotic and disruptive to trade, business and with massive unemployment quite likely.

OP Your points are not clearly stated for proper understanding of.your tread Don't you think its a structure ore a.pattern that has been set  by the financial institutions and even the government of the country. Depths are depts regardless of the ratio you want to share it to. They are obviously ways they are using to recreate more wealth and profits. So however way the depts are still correct and still stands

My companion here, @coupable, is right what exactly is your point with this topic you’ve created? To be honest, everyone knows that what you’re talking about is just how countries work; there isn't a single country without debt. Instead, they all owe money to one another. The only difference is the actual amount they’ve borrowed. That’s why it’s a good thing Bitcoin was created to provide help to anyone who understands or sees its potential to assist us with the financial problems facing communities worldwide.

Does it matter whether the debt is real or not? What's clear is that when you take on debt, you agree to its policies and terms; paying debts is absolutely essential. And it's real, and the impact is real. If the issue is numbers, and they're not real, then everything seems unreal. Even the money in our accounts doesn't seem real because it's just digits. So, whatever the debt, make sure we pay for it.

Theorically, this is true. But practically, can bitcoin be used as it was supposed to be or does bitcoin was built to replace fiat money? In an imaginary scenario, bitcoin is a currency of freedom but alone in an empty space. Or should bitcoin be just able to co-exist with fiat money? Because as we can see, bitcoin can't replace fiat money worldwide or even at a small scale since the global system is inter-connected.

Debt is real, and that's why even the USA has a lot of debt. Our country has estimated debt of $16T-$17T and it keeps on ballooning. That's why all of these economic concerns are happening. The markets are being up and down. While the big businesses and corporations are leveraging debt in their advantage, that's the reason why you define what debt is real and good and what's not and bad. Otherwise, the markets like Bitcoin, it's not dealt with debt and the market cap that it has got is mainly factored by several things including the miners, power supply, etc. Although we know that some holders are borrowing to buy bitcoin which is not a good thing to do.

Can you explain better? I have against how the government makes fiat to be like scam and I do not like inflation, but I do not condemn that debt is real because they are actually real. If you think debt is not real, go and borrow $1000 and pay back just 10 to 15% of it which is $100 to $150 and let us see why you said that debt is not real.

Our money has value because we agree with that value, but we have only real money 20% the rest is kind of non existing money it means everything you buying with money its kind of stealing.

Some of the money you have today isn't real because sometimes it's just a nominal amount, but when calculated as a whole, it doesn't fully cover the total amount. I once had an experience in banking and when I wanted to withdraw a large amount of my savings, they asked me to wait because the typical balance wasn't sufficient. Overall I don't see money as real it's probably just a number given to us when we save with them. It's just a small amount from an individual and if we calculate how much of that money would be in the aggregate, it would be almost unreal. But what is clear is that when we take out a loan, we consciously agree to the terms and conditions and we must repay it on time. This is the reason why fiat is not an alternative when viewed as savings because apart from continuing to experience depreciation there is also no clarity regarding the exact number of amounts available, so that a recession or other conditions emerge that can cause worse conditions in the current economic journey.

Debt is not real? Ok, well if you ever did get access to credit - and I'm not sure you could right now - you'd soon understand that if you don't pay your debts then you'll have very big problems. It's true what you're talking about with regards to leverage ratios, but there simply would not be enough money floating around if banks were not arranged in this way and the world has been working this way successfully for centuries now. It's like you think you've discovered some hidden secret, but this information is well known for anyone that cared to look. It's how banks make the majority of their profits, based on the amount of people who save with them versus the amount of people they issue loans and mortgages.

Na the debt is not fake money the banks can create money when they lend but it is not some magic $1  $9 glitch like people say. the rules are way tighter than that. the $38T US debt is not supposed to be a pile of cash it is legal iou's owed to investors. most modern money is digital numbers now a day so yeah but it is still real because the system enforces it

What's the point you are trying to make? Debt is real, because you borrow money and promise that you are going to return it with an interest, and that's how the system works. It's obvious that if you take a loan, you have to pay interest for it, because the entity is giving you money and will surely want something in return, and if you don't repay the loan on time, your interet will keep increasing, and over time, the accrued interest might even become more than the debt itself, but that's your fault, because you couldn't clear your debt on time and now it is creating problems for you. This is why it's not recommended for people or companies to take loans if they don't have a proper repayment plan and structure. So many individuals take loans or borrow money to fulfill a need but they don't have a plan on how they are going to repay that loan, and that happens mostly when you don't have a stable source of income. So such debts are called bad debts, because it will create problems for you and you could also get in a lot of trouble if you don't repay the debt after some time when the time has already passed.

Why on earth will one think debts are not real, let's be realistic here imagine you intend to purchase a bulk of items and you were out of funds but then you needed them badly and now inorder to enable you get what you've purchased you were granted a privilege and opportunity to get the stuffs while you pay back later, sometimes it could be with a collateral or something in return. So here you've own a debt. And I'll say 60% of individuals and countries owe debts to one country ot the other to fit up with their demands so definitely debts are real.

The two are not exactly the same though. The loans bank give out to regular people is based on fractional reserve banking system where the bank only has to have a small fraction of what they lend as reserve. But US national debt is basically money printed out of thin air and sold to others, specially other bag-holder countries, as bonds which they have to pay an interest on. For example China actually paid real fiat for the $1.6 trillion bonds they were bag holding and got paid the interest for a long time, which is where they got billions of dollars to build their country LOL. They also got real fiat when they dumped like half of those bonds down to $0.8 trillion.

why does $1 asset become $9 debt how do you figure this is true? I suggest you watch this movie: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_Wonderful_Life and understand how debt is backed by more than cash.

Saying debt is not real is misleading because the idea itself comes from how fractional banking works to begin with. Even if banks create money through lending, the debt is still real because it has legal and economic consequences at the end. People, so, companies and governments must repay it with real income, taxes or their assets. Because if they don’t, then there are defaults, losses and crises as well.

I describe US's practice as legal practice with asimetris benefit, Bank and nation get flexibility /leverage, public bear inflation & crisis. For the US, fractional reserve is not the real problem considering US still can maintain market trust and investor confidence with all its privileged such as USD as reserve currency, bonds markets depth, strongest military plus geopolitics position and the last is FED independence agresif intervention ability. What we should worry which US debt issue (money from debt is guaranted by debt)  are its over leveraging and decreased fiscal productivity which caused structural load or even pressure when economic return from additional debt decreased. Psychologically USD value illustrated common trust, only trust and debt that collateralized not gold or physical money. From this point , we can understand how strong US with all its privilege as war winner. Is there any country that dares or willing to practice the US way ?